Customerland
Customerland is a podcast about …. Customers. How to get more of them. How to keep them. What makes them tick. We talk to the experts, the technologies and occasionally, actual people – you know, customers – to find out what they’re all about.So if you’re a CX pro, a loyalty marketer, a brand owner, an agency planner … if you’re a CRM & personalization geek, if you’re a customer service / CSAT / NPS nerd – you finally have a home.
Customerland
Retailers' Guide to the Upcoming Circular Economy Mandate
In this episode, we explore the European Union's Digital Product Passport (DPP) framework—a groundbreaking initiative designed to enhance product transparency and accelerate the transition to a circular economy. Megan Brewster, VP of Advanced Technology at Impinj, offers her expert insights into how this regulatory shift will reshape how products are labeled, tracked, and understood. Drawing comparisons to the transformative impact of GDPR, Megan highlights why businesses worldwide—especially those serving the EU market—must act now to prepare for these changes.
The textiles industry faces a pivotal deadline for DPP compliance by mid-2027, marking a significant shift toward greater sustainability and accountability. Megan delves into the challenges and opportunities this framework brings, from the need for strategic planning and robust data collection to the critical role technology like RFID plays in bridging gaps between operational realities and corporate sustainability goals. With practical advice and forward-looking strategies, Megan emphasizes how aligning with the DPP can benefit businesses’ bottom lines while fostering global environmental leadership.
This episode not only unpacks the regulatory requirements but also explores how businesses can leverage these changes to drive innovation, reduce waste, and build stronger consumer relationships. Whether you're in retail, supply chain management, or sustainability, this conversation is packed with actionable insights to help navigate the future of product transparency and compliance.
The European Union's Digital Product Passport is the first of its kind regulatory framework that's intended to create transparency around product information and also accelerate that transition to the circular economy, and I think the two big takeaways that I want your audience to know is that, even though it's in Europe, it's impacting businesses around the world because anyone selling into the European market is going to be impacted by these regulations.
Mike Giambattista:I'd like to let that statement just hang in the air for a moment, because the impact is huge. If you do business in Europe on some level, you will be required to adhere to these regulations. Megan Brewster is VP of Advanced Technology at Impinj, but that title doesn't even begin to do justice to the rest of the things that I want to say about her. But let's just start with this Former fellow and senior policy advisor for the White House Office of Science and Technology Policy. Big mouthful but also a humongous remit. We could probably spend the rest of this conversation just talking about that part of your resume. We've got other things to deal with, but first of all, thank you for this. I really appreciate it.
Megan Brewster:Thank you so much for the time, mike. I really appreciate it. This is a great opportunity to chat with you and, as we were just discussing, help share what is coming down the pike with Digital Product Passport, and I think the role of government and regulations in driving sustainability and driving the adoption of advanced technologies is so interesting. Ties back a little bit to my background at the White House, as you mentioned, where I oversaw the coordination of 13 federal agencies around advanced manufacturing, and that's actually where I got my initial work with RFID was during that time. I'm a material scientist, I'm a technologist by background, but more in the semiconductor, nanotechnology space.
Megan Brewster:So while at the White House, I picked up advanced manufacturing, learned about RFID, and I'm thrilled to be here now at Impinj where, as VP of advanced technology, I'm looking at what are those future use cases for our technology, for RAIN RFID, and what are the technology development that we need to start now so that we can be ready for when those use cases roll out and deploy in the future. And that involves internal R&D, that involves external partnerships, that involves industry alliances and international standards. So it's a pretty big remit and what my team and I have been working on almost exclusively for the last two years, is sustainability and trying to understand how does RainRFID enable sustainability of everyday items? And for your listeners that may not be aware of RainRFID technology, you can think of this as like a wireless barcode and you're probably already seeing it in your everyday lives when you go shop at retail stores. Even there's some pilots coming up in grocery stores. So your everyday consumer life, you're probably already running into our technology.
Mike Giambattista:Whether you know it or not, it's out there Exactly. I can't help but think of the kind of parallels between DPP, which we'll talk about in a minute, and GDPR. When it first showed up on the horizon for US companies, whatever, that was maybe eight or 10 years ago, and it's a similar sentiment. I think that, oh, there's something big coming down the pike. It's probably really important. It's probably going to affect the way I do business, but I have other priorities, so I'll get to it when I get to it.
Mike Giambattista:And it seems like and I'd love to hear your opinions on this it seems like it wasn't until GDPR showed that it had some fangs, that that the penalties could significant, that companies started to take it seriously, and maybe it was even until the first few of those penalties were issued. But with DPP it's a different idea altogether. There are regulations that came out of the EU. Again, I'll let you explain this far better than I could, but I think right now, for a lot of US companies and I've spoken to a handful this is by no means a universal statement, but they're sort of aware of what it is. They're sort of aware that it's coming down the pike, but sort of not really paying attention to it, what are your thoughts and what are you seeing out there?
Megan Brewster:Yeah, I think you've hit it exactly correct. We're seeing the same thing. So the European Union's digital product passport is the first of its kind regulatory framework that's intended to create transparency around product information and also accelerate that transition to the circular economy. And I think the two big takeaways that I want your audience to know is that, even though it's in Europe, it's impacting businesses around the world, because anyone selling into the European market is going to be impacted by these regulations.
Mike Giambattista:I'd like to let that statement just hang in the air for a moment, because the impact is huge. If you do business in Europe on some level, you will be required to adhere to these regulations.
Megan Brewster:Exactly, exactly, and you know, united States does hundreds of billions of dollars of exports to the EU and when you think of it, by 2030, most end use and intermediate products that are sold into the EU are going to require a digital product passport. So if your business is selling end products in the European Union, you're definitely impacted. But even if you're selling components or intermediate products that are then manufactured into products into the EU and sold there, you will also be impacted by this.
Mike Giambattista:So I'm glad that you kind of framed this up in its two kind of primary purposes. You know one to provide additional transparency but kind of also accelerate I forget the word you used, but you know kind of the circular economy.
Megan Brewster:Exactly, exactly.
Mike Giambattista:And yet I would say that, again speaking, I'm becoming the voice of US companies, which is a very dangerous thing to do here. But those are all, I would say, aspirational goals. But again, I keep thinking about GDPR, and it was. Everybody thought, well, this is great, we're going to be providing additional layers of safety and security for our users' identities and their information, but it didn't really take until it had to take. Are you finding that same kind of resistance like we'll get to it? Or is it an awareness thing? Is it just a I don't know what do you think?
Megan Brewster:Yeah, that's an interesting perspective. I mean, we are seeing retailers very much in these conversations, in the rooms where these standards are being developed, and these kind of initial studies to understand what is the state of the art today. Initial studies to understand what is the state of the art today, what are the different ways that the EU could take this legislation and what would be the impact to the market. We are seeing brands in these conversations and they're rolling up their sleeves and they're excited about it. They see sustainability as the only way forward. They are hearing it from their consumers that the consumers want those to really stand up and enable the circular economy and so, honestly, we're seeing brands taking advantage of this regulatory driver as an opportunity to accelerate their own businesses' transition to a circular economy.
Mike Giambattista:Maybe this is just a function of incrementality and you can advise. Rfid has been around for a bit. It's been a really big deal in supply chain and tracking Um. It's been a really big deal in supply chain and tracking Um. But I think what DPP is proposing is our, our entirely new levels of information being carried there. Am I right there? Or is this the same stuff that's been around and kind of utilized but now it's being forced?
Megan Brewster:Yeah, you know, I would say it's um, it's, it's a continuation of what's already being done, but it's towards different use cases.
Megan Brewster:So the concept is that every, as I mentioned, most items, be it intermediate or end-use products sold in the EU are going to require this digital product passport, and essentially what that means is they require a virtual label that has information about that product's origins, the materials that were used, the manufacturing processes, how you recycle it, information like that and it's up to brands and retailers to determine what is the data carrier that they would like to use to apply to enable that virtual label, and so there can be a variety of different technologies. Rainrfid is one. There's also optical data carriers, like QR codes, that could be used, for example, and they will have to either provide this information in the data carrier or, better yet, in our opinion, is to link to that information in the cloud, because when you think about all of the information that you could provide about the product's origin, the material used, how it's recycled, it's just not going to fit into the data carrier that's actually on the label itself, and so that was one of my questions.
Mike Giambattista:You're talking about potentially a big list of information.
Megan Brewster:Exactly, exactly. So from the data carrier perspective, it is kind of a continuation of what we've been doing, but in terms of the types of information that you're going to provide, who you're going to be providing it, to how you enable the permissions and rights access, you know who's asking for this information. Is it a consumer? Is it someone else in my supply chain? Is it a government official for our import export compliance? Who's asking for this information and making sure that you're getting them the information that they need to make their decisions? That is all new and you know the DPP is intending to bring those use cases to the forefront, to accelerate in that regard. So we do have. The technology is available today. It's deployed today just for other use cases.
Mike Giambattista:Right. Okay, so at Impinj I'm moderately you're not just deploying the tracking technology, but the ability to actually do the tracking and analysis and aggregate the data. Is that right?
Megan Brewster:So the Impinj technology is based on our tag chips, so you can think of the tag chips as the silicon brain that sits at the center of the tag and the tag is basically the label that's applied to the product. We also, in addition to that product line, we also make on the other side of the communications link. The tag is talking to a reader, and so we make the reader chips and the readers and gateways, as well as the platform that enables that communication between the tag and the reader and the upper layers of software and cloud services. For example, if you wanted to authenticate the data carrier, to make sure that, hey, the tag that's applied to this product, this really is the right tag. It's not like someone peeled it off and put another tag on. That level of authentication is something that the Impinj platform provides. And in terms of what are people using this technology for?
Megan Brewster:In the retail sector, we're seeing use that. What I like to refer to as the gateway use case is inventory management, so just knowing what's in your four walls. So if you tag every individual item that's in your store, once you do that, we're having retailers are reporting huge improvements in terms of their ROI. They're seeing 25% to 30% increases in inventory accuracy so really knowing what is in their four walls 50% reductions in out of stocks. Up to 80% improvements in shipping and picking accuracy and in terms of cycle count times 25 times faster. So this technology although it may be a bit of a lift to get those tags, to tag every item in your store and install those readers that ROI is making it worth it and that's why we're seeing deployments. Our industry did 45 billion units just last year and we grow every year.
Megan Brewster:Retailers are expanding their deployment and new retailers are jumping on board. And the inventory management use case is just where you start, once you have every item in your store tagged. We're seeing retailers build on that with other use cases. They're moving towards, you know, point of sale checkout for a more seamless checkout experience for their customers. Loss prevention is a really interesting and exciting use case. Also moving up the supply chain, thinking about, for example, inbound shipment verification, if your items are tagged at the supplier so that when they reach your store-purchase that are enabled and that are driven by digital product passport. And I think what's key here is that brands can think about this as an opportunity to continue their relationship with that consumer past that point of purchase. They walk out of your store with the items they purchased. But that relationship continues through this circular economy, through the digital product passport.
Mike Giambattista:There are another 10,000 questions I have now about all the potential use cases, how that might get worked out, but I think just to stay somewhat on topic here, I think it'd be really interesting to hear your points of view on what some of the hurdles are. What are some of the considerations that brands and retailers have to make in order to deploy this? I mean, we've talked about the benefits. They're they're pretty clear. There's a it sounds like a very quick ROI once you're up and running here, but there's more to consider. There's there's a financial lift, there's a technological lift, et cetera. So, when you're in these conversations, what are some of the things that brands and retailers are throwing back to you, saying help us get past these hurdles so that we can do this?
Megan Brewster:Yeah, there's a lot that retailers should do to prepare to comply with these regulations and just before we unpack that, in terms of timeline, when do I have to comply with these things? Probably it's going to be second half of 2027. So that is 18 months after the publication of what's referred to as a delegated act, and this is specifically for textiles. Now, digital product passport is going to impact multiple product categories. Textiles is the next one that's up. Batteries for electric vehicles has already gone and there's going to be more in the future. There's iron and steel, electronic components, a variety of different types of items, but textiles is next and the deadline for compliance is going to be mid-2027.
Megan Brewster:So, in terms of what should retailers be doing to prepare for that and kind of what are some of the challenges that they're going to need to overcome? I think you know, first and foremost, the digital product passport legislation is. You know the framework is there, but I would say we are very much building the plane in the air. There is an ongoing, very active conversation between stakeholders that are going to be impacted by this digital product passport regulation and the legislators themselves. That's happening right now through numerous forums, standards, organizations and other stakeholder groups.
Mike Giambattista:Is that mostly a Europe-UK-based conversation, or is that really crossed the pond, so to speak? Groups Is that mostly a Europe UK-based conversation, or is that really, you know, cross the pond, so to speak?
Megan Brewster:Yeah, it is. It's a bit of both. It is, the standards conversation is in the EU, but there is, for example, this recent launch of the EcoDesign Forum. They're doing their call for participation right now and that does involve participants from around the world. They don't need to be just in the EU but, from a retailer's perspective, just knowing that this is a very fluid landscape in terms of what those final regulations could look like, it's worth considering identifying an internal expert or a trusted consultant to help you oversee the progression and the evolution of this legislation. You know timelines may shift. It's just a good idea to find an effective way to monitor that ongoing conversation. So that's kind of. I think.
Megan Brewster:The first challenge is what exactly do I need to comply with? Well, it's not clear. So pay attention, monitor the discussion. I think the second thing is starting to evaluate how are you going to? What are your products that you sell? What are your needs as a business? How is it going to be impacted by DPP? And starting to think about how would you achieve, how would you do that data collection, what would be the systems and the technologies that you would want to consider to meet those requirements?
Megan Brewster:And then I think the third is consider implementing those solutions. Get started. Raynarf FID is one example, as I mentioned. There's other data carriers that you could also consider. But as you are implementing those solutions, knowing that these solutions are going to start enabling that relationship with your consumer after that point of purchase, I think it's also really important to consider making sure that you are respecting consumer privacy. So, thinking about that, thinking about access permissions to different pieces of information contained in that digital product passport, so you can have, you know you can have what are the benefits for you, for your retail business, but also making sure that you are benefiting the consumer. You're providing them the information they need and also protecting them as well.
Mike Giambattista:Um, because you are who you are working for, a company that's uh, uh, uh, at the top ish of that pyramid. Um, you know, you probably have a view to uh, how these things, these ideas, travel in a corporate culture, corporate structure to get implemented. Which makes me wonder. You know, when you start this conversation and I don't know if this is you or your team member or your colleagues, but you know, when someone from Impinj opens up a conversation with a brand or retailer to start thinking like this is it mostly a? It's kind of a dumb question, really, but is it, is it a consultative approach to we're going to help you solve your DPP and related problems, or is it mostly like we have to get to a, a specific solution that they have come to you with? Am I making any sense? Is there an actual question? Yeah, no, that makes sense. That makes sense and I will say Am I making any sense?
Megan Brewster:Is there an actual question on that? Yeah, no, that makes sense. That makes sense, and I will say this is definitely the purview of my very, very effective and professional colleagues in our sales team, so I am taking a guess at the magic that they do for our customers.
Mike Giambattista:It would be better than me framing up a question I couldn't frame up, so please.
Megan Brewster:No, not at all. Not at all. You know there's the impinge. Although we sell tag chips and we sell them to our partners that then take those chips, they place them into what is referred to as an inlay, they convert that into a label and then that is generally what brands are buying is those labels to then apply to their products.
Megan Brewster:Impinj, does you know, take very seriously our role as a trusted advisor, and so we do have a lot of brands and you know folks at various points in the supply chain that come to us and want to learn more about RainRFID and again, we take that position as a trusted advisor very seriously. So sometimes those conversations, and many times those conversations are kind of more consulting in nature, because we are helping brands and know brands and retailers understand, you know, here are the challenges you have, here are different ways you can solve them. This is where we think Raynarf ID can help. Let us recommend to you some of our Impinj partners where you could potentially purchase the equipment that you need to solve your use cases. So that is kind of what that conversation looks like if you reach out to Impinj.
Mike Giambattista:Gotcha Gotcha. Thank you for answering a question that way better than.
Megan Brewster:I asked.
Mike Giambattista:So, you know, you kind of recommend starting off by identifying call it an ambassador internally, or an external consultant to do this Internally though, because this is, you know, uh, dpp is a is a new idea. Um, it is now being forced uh, you know it's kind of forced consideration. So, internally, where do those experts typically come from? Is it you know these are people who have worked in supply chain? Is it people who have worked on privacy? Tell me where one might find a person like this in an organizational chart.
Megan Brewster:Yeah, this is actually an incredibly interesting question because one of the things that my team and I have found as we've been working on sustainability is that we end up talking to different parts of the same company. So we'll be talking to the RFID team and we'll unpack that in just a second about where exactly in the org they sit, and then we'll also be talking to the sustainability team and we want to tell the story of all the different ways that RainRFID enables sustainability and can help companies reach their sustainability goals. But sometimes those are two different teams and those teams generally don't talk. But it's interesting when you consider how can a brand, how can a company, how can a retailer improve their sustainability. Internal efficiency and supply chain efficiency is a huge opportunity. Reducing shrink every item that is lost. That is the carbon footprint of that item that has just evaporated and was never used as it was intended. So those efficiencies are such great opportunities for a company to improve their sustainability. And so I guess, if I had to think of one more outcome I would love your audience to take away from this conversation is please find a way to get your operations teams to talk with your sustainability teams, because that could be such an interesting conversation.
Megan Brewster:So where do the folks who consider implementing RainRFID in your businesses sit? It varies. Sometimes it's in, usually it's in the operations and kind of supply chain management teams. We're seeing some companies if they're large enough, they will launch their own RFID team so that they can be really focused on making sure that they're picking the right technology. They're piloting it within a store before they deploy across their chains. So sometimes we're seeing the standup of an RFID team, but it's a combination of, you know, operations. Supply chain IT is a very important part of this discussion as well and sometimes, you know the technology team sometimes like the CTO team is involved as well and that's generally where the folks are that are the ones that are considering and deploying technologies like RainRFID.
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Mike Giambattista:Sustainability is a really, really interesting concept to retailers right now, because you can be fully on board, fully gung-ho, right down the path, genuinely pursuing sustainability goals, or you can be something other than that, and there's a lot of worry about, um, you know, greenwashing or perceived greenwashing, and how you know if my, my sustainability goals are real and genuine.
Mike Giambattista:We're spending money and putting forth effort. Um, you know, I still have to manage the optics of that somehow, so that you know it, it works out and I I would love to have a seriously offline conversation about your views there. But you know, we're about to face a pretty significant change in our regulatory environment here in this country that, I think, portends some. It could make sustainability goals, uh, a little bit more challenging. So, um, I don't know if you know you have spent time in the white house, you have you understand, uh, governmentally, what this might look like. You know for, for companies who are, who are considering what they're going to have to do to deal with DPP, considering the likely new regulatory environment. What would you say to these folks at this point?
Megan Brewster:Yeah, you've got a number of very interesting questions and this is definitely one of them. Sustainability is not going anywhere. The consumers have made their voice clear that this is something they care about. Now the regulatory environment might change, but I think sustainability is going to continue to be a top priority. It has been a top priority for young people and I think it's a priority for people of all ages. Honestly, and when you think about sustainability, there's different aspects to it. It's not just the environmental aspect. There's also the durability of your products. There's the reputation of your brand associated with the durability of your products. Those are all related. And I think supply chain efficiency you know, improving the efficiency of your retail that impacts your bottom line. So I mean that's dollars and cents. So I think that sustainability will continue to be important. It's just going to maybe look a little bit different.
Mike Giambattista:I think that's why I kind of asked the question too. And just, you know, as we're talking and I'm thinking through what you're saying, you know there are significant financial benefits to deploying this technology and there are significant sustainability benefits. And I'm just wondering, you know, is this going to have to be a financial first conversation and sustainability is a healthy byproduct of the effort or will sustainability lead the conversation? I don't think that's really knowable yet, unless you do.
Megan Brewster:Yeah, no, I agree with you.
Megan Brewster:I think it's not necessarily knowable.
Megan Brewster:I will say we, to date, we see most people deploy for the financial benefit and the sustainability is just this happy byproduct of it. With that said, part of the story that we want to share with the world is that these sustainability benefits are real. We are starting to see them in deployments and many companies do have these sustainability goals, but the people setting those goals are generally not talking to the operations folks, so they don't even know that this is are generally not talking to the operations folks, so they don't even know that this is within their you know happening within their company, and they should be, you know, they should be getting credit for that. So I think the other thing is that the regulation regime in this country, the kind of the regulatory paradigm, will shift, as it does with every administration, but businesses deploying these technologies need to take a long view, a long-term view that is going to go beyond a single administration Plus these drivers in the EU. Eu has a longstanding leadership in environmental and sustainability and I don't think that's going to change anytime soon.
Mike Giambattista:That's not going away.
Megan Brewster:Yeah, and for many companies that are selling into international markets. If you've got to meet those regulations in the EU, why not just make them pervasive across all of the markets that you sell into?
Mike Giambattista:Yeah, Well, this is this has been amazing. I um, I hope we can, we can do this again. Frankly, I don't know if you know what your schedule is like another six months or so just to see how and where things are, what progression towards DPP looks like, um, and whatever other kinds of things you see from your corner of the world that you think retailers and brands would like to know about would be great.
Megan Brewster:Thank you. This has been such a great conversation and it was really great to talk with you, Mike.
Mike Giambattista:Thank you and a lot of fun Thanks.
Megan Brewster:Megan yeah.
